Debates on ISKCON Exposed Video Part 8
Editors Note: We had posted a video of a media coverage in News 9, an English news channel based out of Bangalore. http://www.iskcontimes.com/iskcon-exposed The channel had aired this documentary during prime time. The documentary exposes the malpractices of unauthorized Gurus of ISKCON and touches upon the possible poisoning of Srila Prabhupada. We received very extensive comments on this video in Face Book. We produce below the debates almost verbatim only editing out some content to aid readability. We request readers to send in their comments and join the debate
Mahaprabhu Chaitanya Das In July 11, 1969 letter to Jayapataka Swami that you quoted - the Guru is coming back - incarnating to save the disciple again.
So if Srila Prabhupada has to reincarnate to save a disciple - does he have to become a ritvik priest - and won’t he be allowed to initiate ?
It doesn’t sound so convincing that he cannot.. because if its SP he is qualified, right ?
Mahaprabhu Chaitanya Das Regarding this quote of SP saying he has not given sannyas to anyone - do you have the exact words or the tape - and real transcript.
If you don’t, or haven’t heard the words exactly - there could be some errors in your understanding.
Nimai Nitay NO BODY....we are not much concerned with the bodies...everyone lives eternally..aham brahma'asmi.......
Srila Prabhupada: Thank you. That is the real presence. Physical presence is not important. (Room Conversation, Vrindavana, 6/10/77)
There are two conceptions, the physical conception and the vibrational conception. The physical conception is temporary. The vibrational conception is eternal.[...] When we feel separation from Krishna or the Spiritual Master, we should just try to remember their words or instructions, and we will no longer feel that separation. Such association with Krishna and the Spiritual Master should be association by vibration not physical presence. That is real association.
(Elevation to Krishna Consciousness,(BBT 1973), Page 57)
Therefore we should take advantage of the Vani, not the physical presence.
(Letter to Suci Devi Dasi, 4/11/75) The chanting Hare Krishna is our main business, that is real initiation. And as you are all following my instruction, in that matter, the initiator is already there.”
- Srila Prabhupada Letter to Tamala Krishna, 19 August, 1968
Nimai Nitay And of course we can Always verify with Srila Prabhupada's vani..and advanced spiritually devotees, who are TRUE representatives and followers of the Acharya Srila Prabhupada. Even to be 24 hours with the guru, there is NO guarantee at all, that someone will advance spiritually.
Nimai Nitay Srila Prabhupada is NITYA SIDDHA...and He remains a NITYA SIDDHA no matter how many times He has to appear.
Nimai Nitay That quote is from the personal diary of the late Tamala Krishna (Thomas Hertzig) and he revealed this information in 1980,when he was banned by the gbc, because he proclaimed himself to be the most prominent link to Prabhupada, being secretary of Prabhupada up to the Acharya's disappearance. It is recorded at Topanga canion. Pyramid house confession, 3rd December, 1980. Later on, when the gbc members became afraid of him speaking too much and revealing so many truths about the Real Orders of Srila Prabhupada, the gbc reinstated him as "initiating guru".. "elevating" him..and he stopped immediately exposing the huge cheating proccess, they were doing.., but already things were on record. In the year 2002 he said few times, very seriously on the main pandal and his room upstairs, that he wants to make ONE very important and crucial announcement.., but somehow or other he couldn't make it..and he left the body in a horrific..and suspicious way..... By the year 1980-1 from the 4724 initially initiated disciples of Srila Prabhupada, 3000 had left ISKCON, because they did NOT agree to worship the "lotus feet" of the 11 self appointed "gurus"...and why so...simply because this demand the 11 had goes exactly opposite with the teachings of the Acharya Srila Prabhupada. Prabhupada Never appointed them to act as regular gurus..and everyone was/is disciple of Srila Prabhupada.
Nimai Nitay Please, remember...it is NOT a question of fault finding or pointing out the mistakes of the others.......rather it is simply about Searching and Speaking the TRUTH with facts and evidences. As people, who want to please Srila Prabhupada and thus advance spiritually..No sane man derives any pleasure from the fall of someone from grace.., be that even a newly joined bhakta.
Nimai Nitay Prabhupada is very merciful.., but even He was disgusted from repeated again and again abominable activities performed, especially by His leading disciples. Srila Prabhupada: There have been so many fallen down. First of all there will be no sannyasi anymore. I have got very bad experience. And at least, we are not going to create new sannyasis. And those who have fallen down, let them marry, live like respectable gentlemen. I have no objection. After all, young man, fallen down—that's all right. It is by nature's way. But marry that girl....(Prabhupada conversation Jan 7, 1977)
Its interesting that one can accept some statements of a person they distrust and reject others. So the deciding authority is oneself ?
Mahaprabhu Chaitanya Das Regarding the Guru incarnate thing - are you yourself convinced of the explanation you gave to my query ?
Mahaprabhu Chaitanya Das NO offense meant to you or anyone - it is important to also identify yourself - who you are - your photo - what you do etc.
After all Srila Prabhupada said - Caesar's wife should be above suspicion.
He recommended that we should be public about our behavior, character - so people can trust us.
So we would be happy to know how you look, so we are convinced we are hearing arguments being repeated by a person - who is actually following sadhana, a devotional lifestyle etc.
Someone who has faith in Guru and Krishna enough to not hide - someone who is not afraid of being "punished" for speaking the truth.
Else showing such fears conveys lack of faith in what one talks of - or a possible hidden motive - to weaken Lord Chaitanya's movement.
Nimai Nitay Absolutely convinced about the position of Prabhupada...., but are you able to see how the deviant people have insured themselves, that their so called "disciples" become envious of Prabhupada too. It's ok...don't bother....do your teaching work in Mayapur......and live as you understand and believe it.
Mahaprabhu Chaitanya Das Kindly reveal who you are - your pictures, your lifestyle, your sadhana - are you a real Srila Prabhupada follower - or someone envious of Srila Prabhupada - who is trying to bewilder devotees.
ISKCON Bangalore devotees can be seen to be following a regular program given by SP - but online entities - it is said many of them don’t even chant 16 rounds - don’t look like devotees - don’t follow the principles - in many cases they are atheists trying to bewilder the theists.
I hope you are not such a case. Kindly reveal your identity.
No offense meant - but best if you want people to trust your words - reveal yourself.
Even milk touched by the lips of a serpent is poisonous - so we want Srila Prabhupada words to be repeated & quoted by a devotee.
So without offending you - I request you to reveal your identity.